I had an "epiphany" yesterday (after much soul-searching and seeking for answers, striving to quiet the conflict and rage that so often prevail in the house of Good Will).
I came upon this solution no small thanks to Log.
In the past, our family has maintained and followed a "chore chart" of sorts. Every able child has been assigned a set of chores, and each has been paid (or not paid) in accordance with his or her performance. This made me (the parent) the "task master", "judge" and "enforcer". And I hated it! My children hated it, too, and they fled from my presence! They often did only the least they could "get away with". They resented being at my beck and call. Sometimes I had to force them to comply with my "demands" just to get the results I wanted.
Eventually I discovered this was the devil's business. I was filled with his spirit. I didn't like it and I didn't like what my children were becoming.
So we changed.
This morning, in family council, I proposed a new "strategy": our new family "motto" would be "May I help you?"
We all agreed that whenever we saw someone doing anything of service to others (primarily cleaning, mowing, folding, washing, etc.), we would say to them "May I help you?" If they said "yes", we would join them in their labors until the job was done or until the burden was lifted.
No running off and avoiding the task (like we sometimes do when we see someone in need on the streets).
No asking for help either. (Unless you cannot possibly do it yourself. Who wants to be a "slave" to be abused at someone else's beck and call?)
Nor would there be any more "assigned chores". Only evident "needs" to be filled. "See a need, fill a need!" and "May I help you?" would become our new family slogans. (Next week I'll add "Is there anything else I may do for you?")
This new principle conforms to the Golden Rule. It also establishes characteristics in us that will serve us well, even as we learn to selflessly serve others. I hope these phrases and patterns will become habitual in all of us. Whenever we walk into a room and find someone doing something, may we naturally say to them: "May I help you?" or "May I join you?"
This is family. This is Zion. This is the kingdom of God. This is not that other, Babylonian system of compulsion and coercion. This is as the dews of heaven, distilling without compulsory means.
After we tried our new "arrangement" for about half an hour -- admittedly somewhat imperfectly, because I have devious and stubborn children! -- I explained to them that the system only works if it is participated in on a completely voluntary basis. If someone seeks to coerce another or if too many slack off and leave the burdens to a few, the whole system breaks down. (Don't we see that in the Book of Mormon?)
This explains why the Lord is so "aloof" at times. He is waiting for us to comply without compulsory means! No compulsion. No coercion. No external control. Just us, acting on our own. No power or influence can or ought to be maintained by virtue of the priesthood if the lessons are to be internalized.
Under this regime, you cannot demand that anyone do anything for you! (You shouldn't even ask for help -- unless you can't do something for yourself.) The closest I come to "demanding" anything today was to say "[such and such] needs to be done". My older children were free either to "volunteer" or not. (Some did and some didn't.) I was pleased with those who did and I was patient with those who didn't. This is the Lord's way.
I still tell my younger children what to do. (They are not self-actuated yet.) But when I do, I follow that up with "May I help you?" (They liked that a lot! Who doesn't like getting help?)
I can only imagine how children would turn out if we employed from their youth this "Zion"-type leadership by example and volunteerism and not the "Babylonian" forms of compulsion and coercion we're so used to.
If voluntarily followed, this "pattern of Zion" can succeed. People can serve, voluntarily, without remuneration and happily, forever. (Whereas in Babylon, people stop working the moment they stop getting paid.)
If we turn away from helping others -- of volunteering our services freely, willingly -- the angels shall turn away from us, saying "As you judged, so shall you be judged! You turned away from others and withheld your assistance and bounty. Consequently, the portals of heaven shall be shut to you!"
Or they may say to us "As you judged, so shall you be judged! Since you freely gave to others and served willingly, so shall it be given freely to you and you shall be served, even by the King, who is pleased to serve those who follow Him. He will receive you unto Himself!"
May it ever so be with us.
just be reconciled to the idea of early apparent failure. Where you do most of the chores yourself without assistance.
ReplyDeleteIs there any way to pattern this so you don't end up teaching that if the kids just do nothing, someone else will just take care of it?
DeleteGood question. This was Will's answer. If it were me, I would not have ruled out allowing (paternalism!) people to ask for help and companionship. But that's me. What's your answer?
DeleteI think it's important to ask for help. The key here — and this is difficult for adults to accept too — that it's "asking" for help, not demanding it. When someone's asked for help, they're free to decline.
DeleteI think we as a society have failed in what it means to ask someone for something. We think they're a horrible person if they decline, and the ones who accept usually passive-aggressively accept and hold grudges or keep score because of the help offered. But in my opinion asking for help in and of itself is a good thing.
Ben,
DeleteMy kids were "clever" enough to ALWAYS "rebound" the request. If I asked them to clean the kitchen (after teaching them that Jesus said to give to them that ask), they would say, "Dad, will you clean it for me?"
I ended up being requested to do EVERY chore, turning ME into the "hypocrite" if I didn't follow my own advice!
Been thinking a lot about this. (also, BenB (me) and Ben are different commenters).
DeleteI don't have many answer yet. I think this approach would do a wonderful job of teaching ME charity. I'm not so sure how what it helps teach the kids. I would expect it would teach indolence, dependence, laziness, etc.
As I said, not really any answers, but a lot of questions.
You're right. It does open the door to indolence, dependence, laziness, etc. My children do all of those things!.
DeleteWhile the policy can be practiced in a vacuum of instruction (God does this all the time!), there's no harm in explaining to your children -- on a regular basis -- what you're doing.
I've "assigned" one of my children to "explain" to the family each day (at prayer time) the policy (as a "reminder"). (Kind of like them giving a "two-minute talk" in Primary.) I will assign each of my children, in turn, until they all get the chance to "mouth the words". (I'm hoping, someday, those words will "sink in".)
Meanwhile, persuasion (and, if that doesn't work), long-suffering, gentleness, meekness, love unfeigned, kindness, pure knowledge....in other words, all the stuff that is generally in short supply around here.
We have a long way to go.
I guess I'm so interested because my family and kids struggle with a lot of the same things yours does. I guess most families do.
DeleteWith my oldest we've tried to adopt the "family economy" type of approach the the Eyres wrote about in their book "The Entitlement Trap." Basically, it is a system to give kids increasing control of their portion of the family budget, help teach them ownership, work, responsibility, etc. I do like the fact that my 9 year old can make mistakes and learn money, responsibility, work etc. in a safer laboratory than the real world, but it does sort of Babylonize the place.
But I'm not sure how well it really is working, and it certainly has some paternalistic basis (they have to accomplish some basic tasks to earn their full allotment). But the fact is, kids ARE incompetent, that's why they are kids and not adults.
So, I guess we're back to the same old question of how much paternalism to mix in to the golden rule, eh Log?
I really like the approach you blog here, though. My comments are not to criticize at all. The dialog helps me, and I probably need a lot more schooling in charity and the golden rule than I'd like to admit.
Maybe persuasion, long-suffering, gentleness, meekness, love unfeigned, kindness, pure knowledge shown by example is sufficient to take care of all my concerns. We, likewise, have a supply problem here.
Oh, were you watching this morning? ;o)
ReplyDeleteNaw, I suffered it too here. The solution I think is to start doing, then invite - without pressure! - others to help. If they decline, no whining, sighing, nagging, or other negative reinforcers... just do what thou doest with as much cheer as can be mustered.
DeleteThis is sooooo hard to do!
DeleteBelieve me... I know. But that is the way of things.
DeleteBut this does solve the rebound problem.
And that was my objective: a righteous way to avoid being turned into a child's "slave".
DeleteThe only way to do that was to stop being the child's "master".
When a child becomes "accountable" enough to begin presuming to direct the parent, it's time to let the child begin to direct himself.
That's what God does.
After they make a perfect mess of things (and, to some extent, they will) and they come back (if they do come back) with a humble heart and a contrite spirit, then the real work can commence.
All that preceded was merely prologue, the stuff of "Mosaic law". Everything that really matters comes afterward.
Perhaps I am too myopic, but for me, I hope that somewhere down the road (perhaps when they have children of their own) they will remember that I worked and the invitation was always open to come and work with me (some do sometimes, some more than others). This is also my approach to teaching them the Gospel, "teach them correct principles (tell them the truth (STRICTLY AND ON EVERY ACCOUNT) and they govern themselves" (hopefully...someday...).
ReplyDeleteGood luck Will (and Log)
JRU
Here are a few ideas that work in my family. Responsibilities are connected to privileges, so every time I am asked for privileges (like treats, computer, or tv time) I ask, "Are your chores done?" (In our house, these are simple personal tasks- get dressed, say prayers, make bed, clean room, and read scriptures- which can be modified by ability level.) The list doesn't change, and the answer to their request is the same as their response, which can easily be verified. I don't demand compliance or determine the quality of their work because these are their jobs, not mine.. If I question the result, I offer to help so they can get what they asked for.
ReplyDeleteAlso, if they want to watch television, the room they are in needs to be picked up, so they become aware of their environment. I've noticed they really don't see the mess until I point it out. At that point they can choose to clean, and get the tv time, or do something else, like read a book.
As for having to do all the real work myself, that is also tied to getting what they want. For example, the kids are in charge of dishes and I make dinner. My general policy is that I don't cook in a messy kitchen, so if I spend the time cleaning, there might not be dinner. What I have had to let go is the standard of perfection that keeps me working until I'm exhausted. I set my limits and they start to see the needs that are left to get our family goal completed.
Of course, this approach gets "results". But notice it's tit for tat.
Delete"I will give you what you want, but only if you give me what I want."
This is justice, about half-way up Log's metric of socio-spiritual development.
1. Savagery (utter lawlessness, ie. cannibalism)
2. Vengeance ("I'll get you, my pretty, and your little dog, too!")
3. Justice ("an eye for an eye")
4. Friendship ("bless them that bless you")
5. Charity ("bless them that curse you")
Christ taught charity. Most of us spend most of our lives missing the mark.
That's cute. Close enough for government work.
DeleteIt depends on what results you are looking for. You want children who ask, "Do you need any help?" My children ask me that quite often, and not for any expected reward.
DeletePart of the formula is ownership of the problem. If cleaning to a certain standard is my problem, I "own" all the work and need their help. If their chores are defined as their responsibility and I let them decide how and when they do their work, they can ask for help,or let them go completely. If I can't let the job go completely, it is really my work that I am compelling them to perform. However, all of us need incentives to do our own work, or we slack off. They happen to be in the habit of asking for snacks and computer time when they are bored, so I use that as a cue to remind them about their forgotten chores. As adults, we use other incentives (paychecks, company coming, approaching mealtime) to get us moving. Kids just need more outside support to get the habits in place.
I assume that #5-charity would be your basis for understanding the works of Christ, yet he didn't seem to help/heal anyone without them first owning their own problem and asking for help.
How do you incorporate the principle of blessings predicated on obedience to laws? Aka positive or negative consequences? What about compulsion you as a parent are to adhere to, especially in regards to home schooling and the children's "performance"?
ReplyDeleteWhat is the law that you're trying to obey? "Cleanliness is next to godliness"?
DeleteThe natural consequence of not tidying up is a messy house. When those who suffer the consequences of disorder get sick of it, they'll repent -- and not before. Until then, those who hate disorder will either clean, force others to do so, or suffer.
I'm sick of cleaning and forcing others to obey me. Now I'm willing to try suffering. (God seems willing to do a lot of that.)
I don't understand your question about compulsion and home schooling. What are your children's goals? Do they know why they are studying and how their daily activities tie into their future?
DeleteThe things that have helped our family most are: 1) give the kids some choices in what they study based on their interests, 2) be willing to stay by their side when they are struggling, 3) reward effort. This might come in the form of compliments, giving incremental prizes for completing goals, or more challenging work, if they can prove they are capable of the challenge.
Each child is unique and one of the fun parts of home school is personalizing the experience for each child. I only find compulsion creeping in when I want them to do something that I don't take much interest in myself.
Ranae, the compulsion is the legal aspect from the state one would live in to comply with for the child's education. AZ is one of the least intrusive for tracking their progress, but I do find myself explaining to them after struggling with them to get educational work done, can't avoid it when they're trying to master certain skills sometimes and when you have multiple kids to sit by and help etc. Anyway, I end up explaining to the kids that there is a legal issue for education and I need to do my part in teaching and training them for eventual adulthood...temporally and spiritually...that as a parent, I have a spiritual obligation to do my part...imperfectly and "unfun" as it may be etc.
DeleteGood Will, I am asking about laws in general, not just things like cleanliness is next to godliness as you are specifically discussing as the main example. But your response is still relevant. Ranae mentioned owning the problem and that makes perfect sense...however, it is interesting to take that responsibility and to incorporate teaching and training skills generally necessary for life in general. I find myself explaining why I'm constantly in training mode for getting them to keep their room clean and why a particular standard is requested and at times required (kitchen/bathroom)...I attempt to keep a good atmosphere and tone, but I do fall into human character at times. I try to stay patient and let a particular thing go for several days to sink in and finally be accepted in their timing. Sometimes a "wall" is hit and action feels imperative to happen....a simulation of adult procrastination (like tax prep anyone? Even after filing for an extension? Hahaha) I attempt baby steps as much as possible within these training modes. I help them beyond just verbal instruction and for one child this certainly helps with the feelings of overwhelm. Now, to get them to realize 200 "favorite" pieces of clothing is what keeps them IN overwhelm :::sigh::: I've even used wording that we can bless others with giving away some of our "favorites"...pick 10 favorite shirts and bless someone else with the rest...oh the CRYING that goes on, why are they so "attached" etc? I've even tried having them sell things at the only second hand store in our small city...two children have 100% of their decent chosen items rejected, even 90% of my stuff has been rejected and they've been brand new in season items. That's off topic, but it shows our highly picky state of affairs. We rarely go out of town...so that is frustrating...selling online through local fb groups is next, but can be less "safe" in my paranoid mind and I gave up on craigslist's safety. Ok...I've really gone on a (albeit related) tangent! Anyway...I appreciate this blowout and subsequent comments.
Log....how LONG did it take your family to fail before good fruit became noticable? It might help to have a frame of reference of some kind to cling to as we move forward in the challenge?
Blowout was an autocorrect response to blog post? Ok hahaha
DeleteAnon - Your results depend on your goals.
DeleteWonderful, Will. I will need to use this in the very near future...(No - no new kids on the way) :)
ReplyDeleteWe are ALL children in the sight if God....good luck with your near future "needs" ;-)
Delete24 And secondly, he doth require that ye should do as he hath commanded you; for which if ye do, he doth immediately bless you; and therefore he hath paid you.
ReplyDeleteAh, a scriptural basis for paying my kids to do their chores! (I can think of a few more.) Thanks, Log!
DeleteAnd to update: my family experienced a complete breakdown of housekeeping this week. Few (if any of my children) asked "May I help you?" and virtually none of them was eager to undertake any of their former chores spontaneously, without being asked. (It was a giant "let's take the whole week off!" this week!")
On the other hand, my wife picked up the slack...even as I washed my hands of the whole thing. (I simply couldn't take it! No wonder God seldom pokes His head in around here! We've made a perfect mess of the place!)
Well, it has to be something YOU can do, Will. Something you'll keep up with. I have my own ideas, but in the end, like a diet and gym regimen, it's your self-discipline that counts.
ReplyDeleteFor me, what I'm trying to do is to start, invite help and, even if I can give no other reward, praise my helpers.
Plus, for me, it's not really about getting the house clean beyond the minimum. It's about interacting with my kids as befits a priest.
ReplyDeleteMary or Martha, baby! Your clarity and contributions are appreciated, Log.
ReplyDeleteFor the record, we've switched back to the "stewardship" model of assigned chores, but "seasoned" with "May I help you?"
ReplyDeleteNo more do we say "That's not my job!" but recognize that everyone's "burden" is our burden, even if we have a particular stewardship for which we must give account.
It seems like more work this way, but it's actually less...if everyone pitches in...which we hope will happen.
I'll let you know (if it does).
Ah, but is the stewardship voluntarily accepted, or even sought after? Is there a reward attached to it to motivate the seeking?
ReplyDeleteOr is it a matter of "if you don't do this, then I will punish you?"
"Paternalism" has its place for those incapable of being accountable for themselves.
ReplyDeleteMy older children recognize that "responsibilities" must be shared and borne. They are willing (if not eager) to bear them. The system is embraced voluntarily by them. We understand what happens when no one rises up or does nothing.
The Church's historical method of getting free labor by "calling" people to tasks the Church would otherwise have been paying for is not a good thing. I remember they used to have paid janitors to clean the ward buildings. Now, they pass around a sign-up sheet for families to volunteer to clean the buildings.
ReplyDeleteSucks for the janitors, I suppose, but I bet the guy who came up with that scheme looked good to his superiors.
I don't have a problem offering to pay the kids to do stuff.
I pay them...but only to train them about how the biblical principle of "if you don't work, you don't eat" works.
ReplyDeleteHi Will,
ReplyDeleteI just wanted to report to you, to let you know the effect your post had on my family. I am a single parent with three kids still at home. After I read your post in July, I prayed and decided that we would implement the principles you taught. I needed to stop preaching zion, but instead live it by example. We had a family council where I explained that zion people look for ways to serve and we can't join a zion community unless we live zion in our home. I also re-iterated how much we need to love one another just as Christ loves us and to have a forgiving heart.
So at night during prayer time, I pointed out tasks that needed to be done the next day, and I asked for their help. At first, I did not say a another word about helping, and my oldest daughter caught on fast and from day one she has looked for ways to serve the family. I rarely have to remind her of anything, except her keeping up her room. Every night, before I listed the new tasks I praise them individually for all the good they have done, including tasks accomplished, good attitudes, kindness, forgiveness etc..
Later, I changed my approach with my younger two, because they weren't living the "higher law". I now I tell them only once what I need them to do. Both kids have been significantly more helpful. My son has been especially good at being obedient when I ask for his help, in comparison to what he once was. He is starting to help without being told.
I pray continually for patience, and I am becoming a more patient and a way less angry mother. On a couple of occasions when I have gotten gotten grumpy, my kids have apologized, on their own for not helping. They are also quick to apologize to one another.
Our home has a much better spirit. They are all so much more supportive of one another, they settle difference quietly and are quick to ask and give forgiveness. This new attitude has been noticed by others outside of our family, who have commented on how loving and kind and supportive they are of one another. My older adult kids have really noticed a difference in the quality of home life we now enjoy, and I am hoping they will see the example set by the younger ones and seek zion as well.
Bless you Will for sharing your thoughts with others and helping me to be a better parent.
Lena
Lena,
DeleteI'm glad you're having success. I wish I had as positive a report to contribute! (I will definitely have to revisit the principles espoused here and give everyone an update.)
Unfortunately, I am enmeshed in a much greater, far more demanding and utterly dreadful task right now: striving to preserve my marriage and family! (And I appear to be failing.)
Sorry you are are undergoing this sore trial. Your pain must be so hard to bear. My oldest son is very angry with me at this time. This is an extremely painful situation. We have always had a close relationship. I love my child and I am floored that he does not seek to either prove or disprove the message. I am shocked at his lack of spiritual/intellectual curiosity. I am sadden because I have raised him better than this.
ReplyDeleteOn the positive side, my other four children are progressing nicely. You and your loved ones are in our family's thoughts and prayers.
Thank you. I can only imagine that the very powers of heaven -- and your prayers -- are the only thing sustaining us at this time. Thank you for praying for me and my family.
Delete